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 okgg.org > Forum Index > Politics & Religion > Voting Today

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detox
Naaaaaah. NaaaaaFLAC.


Joined: 20 Mar 2003
Posts: 4317
Location: Durant
Voting Today  Reply with quote  

I suggest you vote NO to SQ 744.


The State Chamber of Oklahoma has joined forces with the One Oklahoma Coalition, a non-partisan, diverse, statewide association, to defeat State Question 744.

WHAT IS SQ 744?

State Question 744 is a proposed amendment to the state constitution that would require Oklahoma state government to spend an amount equal to the average per-pupil expenditure in the six states that surround Oklahoma.

WHAT WOULD SQ 744 MEAN FOR OKLAHOMA?

Should SQ 744 be approved, the Oklahoma legislature and governor will be forced to severely underfund critical state government services by more than $1.7 billion a year once it is fully implemented or require substantial tax increases in property and income taxes to pay for and implement the provisions of SQ 744.

The passage of SQ 744 would also cripple economic development in Oklahoma. The state's economic incentive programs that attract new companies and retain and expand existing companies would end - leading to the loss of thousands of jobs.

EXAMPLES OF THE POTENTIAL IMPACT:

* College tuition rates could skyrocket
* More than $340 million in federal matching dollars to care for seniors, children and ailing Oklahomans could be lost
* As many as nine prisons could be closed - causing the early release of 8,400 criminals
* $192 million could be cut from the state's highway budget - derailing the repair of thousands of crumbling bridges and deteriorating highways

WHY SQ 744 IS A BAD IDEA FOR OKLAHOMA?

There are hundreds of reasons to vote "NO". But here are four big ones . . .

* No oversight or accountability of how millions of your tax dollars will be spent.
* No guarantee that any new funding is spent on children, computers, books,classroom needs or teacher pay raises.
* No reforms in public schools or any type are included in SQ 744.
* No way to pay for SQ 744 without massive tax and fee increases or without devastating budget cuts to all other state programs and services.

VISIT WWW.NOSQ744.COM FOR MORE INFORMATION.

The State Chamber of Oklahoma has developed a position on four of the eleven state questions. To see an explanation and what our positions are - click here.

For questions regarding The State Chamber of Oklahoma's position on SQ 744, please visit our website at www.okstatechamber.com.



330 NE 10th Street, Oklahoma City, OK 73104 (405) 235-3669 * [email protected]

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Post Tue Nov 02, 2010 7:46 am  View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website ICQ Number
Shinare
SEXNOCULAR


Joined: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 13332
Location: Up your butt with a coconut!!
 Reply with quote  

I moved this to the political arena. I also wholeheartedly agree with the NO statement. I will be doing so and I have 2 kids in school right now. This unfunded mandate must die!!!

(and that folks, is a rare sighting of Shinare's political opinions)
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Post Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:20 am  View user's profile Send private message ICQ Number
detox
Naaaaaah. NaaaaaFLAC.


Joined: 20 Mar 2003
Posts: 4317
Location: Durant
 Reply with quote  

sorry i thought i was in the correct section.

I recommend people also vote NO on the health care system and YES to limiting the terms of elected officials.

Enjoy the day. I'm going back to having the flu now.
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Post Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:55 pm  View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website ICQ Number
Brules
M F C E O


Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 11074
Location: Konnichiwa, bitches.
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Geezus thats a stupid fucking bill......Oklahoma to match what Texas spends per pupil??? hahahahah that would bankrupt oklahoma!
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Post Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:56 pm  View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
TehDanMan
Guerilla Ontologist


Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Posts: 13143
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I voted today at 7am. I got there and there wasn't a soul in sight. No idea where the poll workers came from because there were no cars in the parking lot.
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Post Tue Nov 02, 2010 4:12 pm  View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Drix
SEAT #ASS 10


Joined: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 1773
Location: Norman
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Brules wrote: Geezus thats a stupid fucking bill......Oklahoma to match what Texas spends per pupil??? hahahahah that would bankrupt oklahoma!


Exactly, amoung a number of other flaws. Thankfully it failed.
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Post Wed Nov 03, 2010 12:04 pm  View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger ICQ Number
TehDanMan
Guerilla Ontologist


Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Posts: 13143
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I don't have a solution to Oklahoma's education short-comings, but I do know that throwing money at a burning pile of more money just costs you more money.
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Post Wed Nov 03, 2010 12:30 pm  View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
detox
Naaaaaah. NaaaaaFLAC.


Joined: 20 Mar 2003
Posts: 4317
Location: Durant
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I'm going to catch a lot of crap for this from teachers, but I don't think they need more money. (this is JUST for the teachers income, nothing to do with facilities etc)

They get paid


** Salaries are from the 2006-2007 Oklahoma Department of Education, Oklahoma City Public Schools and Norman Public Schools

Oklahoma Minimum Teaching Salaries

Degree Level Step 1 Teaching Salary Step 6 Teaching Salary Step 14 Teaching Salary
Bachelor's Degree $31,000 $33,300 $36,625
Master's Degree $32,200 $34,600 $37,825
Doctorate Degree $33,400 $35,700 $39,025


Norman Public Schools Teaching Salaries

Degree Level Step 1 Teaching Salary Step 6 Teaching Salary Step 14 Teaching Salary
Bachelor's Degree $31,826 $34,522 $38,372
Master's Degree $33,026 $36,029 $42,234
Doctorate Degree $34,226 $38,135 $47,135


Oklahoma City Public Schools Teaching Salaries

Degree Level Step 1 Teaching Salary Step 6 Teaching Salary Step 14 Teaching Salary
Bachelor's Degree $31,100 $33,600 $38,600
Master's Degree $32,200 $34,600 $40,600
Doctorate Degree $33,400 $35,900 $42,000


When viewing these numbers, keep in consideration such benefits as full dental, long-term disability and quality health insurance. Secondly, these are salaries based on a 182-day or 10-month work year. We encourage you to explore what each school district has to offer you, take into consideration the area in which you wish to live and do the math to see if you will be satisfied. Good luck!




If you take info account the number of days off during the year, they don't work weekends, they usually don't work a full 40 hours per week, and they get months off during the year it turns into a pretty hefty hourly wage for them.
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Post Wed Nov 03, 2010 4:55 pm  View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website ICQ Number
nimda
Curator of art Faggory


Joined: 18 Mar 2003
Posts: 12180
Location: on a mountain in colorado
 Reply with quote  

i wouldn't say they usually don't work 40 hours a week. all my teacher friends say the opposite, that they usually work more than 40. but yeah, the 2.5 months of summer vacation and all the other random holidays and days off make up for it.
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Post Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:17 pm  View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger ICQ Number
Goose
Junkie


Joined: 24 Aug 2003
Posts: 568
Location: OKC, OK
 Reply with quote  

For the amount of hours worked, teachers get paid very well. I know very few that really work 40+ hours and I know A LOT that works just enough to keep their job. They are also the same ones that think computers in the classroom are there to babysit the children.

But SQ744 was a stupid bill that should have never been enough put up for a vote!
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Post Wed Nov 03, 2010 10:34 pm  View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address ICQ Number
TehDanMan
Guerilla Ontologist


Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Posts: 13143
 Reply with quote  

I take it you still work for OKCPS, Goose? Smile
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Post Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:46 am  View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
blu
Step on my cubes.


Joined: 19 Mar 2003
Posts: 4638
 Reply with quote  

Goose wrote: I know very few that really work 40+ hours and I know A LOT that works just enough to keep their job. They are also the same ones that think computers in the classroom are there to babysit the children.


This is the reason, IMO, that we need to pay teachers more. Very few truly intelligent people are willing to work for half the salary they can make in the industry of their choice. You are left with only those passionate about teaching who can afford to live off a small salary (i.e. spouse makes good money) and those people who think it's the easiest job they can get. Many of those most passionate about teaching will choose to teach in another state in order to have a livable salary and still be able to teach. There are countless good educators NOT teaching or NOT teaching in Oklahoma because of being unable to live off of the available salary.

You don't get anything close to the best and brightest teaching children in Oklahoma's current system. Pay more and you attract better talent. This is a paramount to industry, and it certainly applies to education as well.

It does take far above 40 hours a week to be a good teacher. Good teachers also incur quite a bit of out of pocket expenses that cannot always be reimbursed by the school system. Even with the argument that teachers only work 3/4 of the year doesn't help much. I wouldn't personally be able to work for 4/3 of the above salaries...

This is not to say I supported this bill or anything, just my perspective on the "they get paid very well" blathering.

Post Thu Nov 04, 2010 11:09 am  View user's profile Send private message
detox
Naaaaaah. NaaaaaFLAC.


Joined: 20 Mar 2003
Posts: 4317
Location: Durant
 Reply with quote  

I guess I should have prefaced my above post(s) by stating that I was raised by a teacher and have a few other relatives that are teachers.

Blu you are correct. The GOOD teachers don't put in the minimum, do incur lots of personal out of pocket expenses, and should make more. Your statements make a great case of the pay to be based on performance.

My mom always said "there are those that can teach and those that can do, and the ones that can do usually go get a real job". I love that the statement was coming from a teacher!
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Post Thu Nov 04, 2010 7:06 pm  View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website ICQ Number
LightningCrash
Smile like Bob, order your free LC today


Joined: 03 Apr 2003
Posts: 5020
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IMO you can't really do pay by performance because the teachers just end up teaching the tests for the performance metrics.

In Texas we had the TAAS tests and a lot of teachers just taught for the TAAS.

Post Fri Nov 05, 2010 6:56 am  View user's profile Send private message
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